[KLUG Members] Re: Members digest, Vol 1 #594 - 6 msgs

randall perry members@kalamazoolinux.org
Fri, 30 Aug 2002 11:51:58 -0200
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Sorry I don't have the K12 email address handy (so please reply to both so 
I don't have to reboot to get it from my evolution client).
BUT, I thought I would keep you posted on the Network Project for the new 
Grace Baptist school in Granger (Mishawaka).

They had 30 PCs donated WITHOUT operating systems.  They range from PII350 
down to 166MMX boxen.  Some of the boxes are incomplete, but scrounging 
from one box to another will work.  Most have TokenRing cards.  I am seeing 
about getting them a CAU and LAM donated from my former employer (I paid 
$4200 for those a little over 3 years ago) as well as the STP.

Anyway, we are looking to install Linux in the computer lab on about 15 
computers.  We are looking at next Saturday if possible.  Anyone is welcome 
to help out regardless of experience level.
We will be:
-assessing hardware inventory
-rebuilding some PC's
-determine which distributions and window managers to install
-installing OSs
-configuring network
-setup email/web/NFS/Samba/bind on one designated as SERVER
-who knows what else?

I have only seen a sample box (Gateway PII even had an LS120 drive in it), 
but I don't know about the rest.
Again, anyone is welcome to join.  Richard, don't forget to get permission 
from the BOSS! (I didn't ask yet either)

Randall Perry

At 12:00 PM 8/30/2002 -0400, you wrote:

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>Today's Topics:
>
>    1. Meeting  2002-09-03 -  Beginners Meeting (listserv@kalamazoolinux.org)
>    2. LAN's and DNS (Peter Buxton)
>    3. Re: LAN's and DNS (Bruce Smith)
>    4. Re: LAN's and DNS (adam@morrison-ind.com)
>    5. Re: LAN's and DNS (Bruce Smith)
>    6. Re: LAN's and DNS (Peter Buxton)
>
>--__--__--
>
>Message: 1
>Date: Fri, 30 Aug 2002 04:00:04 -0400
>To: members@kalamazoolinux.org
>From: listserv@kalamazoolinux.org
>Subject: [KLUG Members] Meeting  2002-09-03 -  Beginners Meeting
>Reply-To: members@kalamazoolinux.org
>
>This meeting is intended for those who are curious about Linux, or want
>some help getting started. Bring your computer to the meeting, and have
>Linux installed on it, at no charge. You can also bring home your own
>Linux CD-ROM , produced locally. You can also come and listen to our new
>user presentation, and have your questions answered about Linux, for
>home or business.
>
>If you are planning on bringing a computer for installation to this
>meeting please fill out the install form to make arrangements.
>Installations are done by appointment ONLY. You must fill out this form
>one week prior to the meeting if you want to bring in your computer.
>Thank you for your cooperation. Feel free to contact our install master
>with any questions.
>
>Now's the time to get started! Linux is becoming a mainstay of free
>software, free choice, dependability and power.
>
>
>-       -       -       -       -       -       -       -       -       -
>
>Coming to three meetings qualifies you as a full member of KLUG, meaning
>that you can participate in the process of making formal decisions, including
>voting for officers.
>
>-       -       -       -       -       -       -       -       -       -
>
>Our meeting place, THIS TUESDAY at 7 PM is:
>
>The Kalamazoo Chamber of Commerce in beautiful downtown Kalamazoo.
>
>Maps and directions can be found at
>http://www.kalamazoolinux.org/meetings/maps.php3
>
>All are welcome.
>
>-       -       -       -       -       -       -       -       -       -
>
>The KLUG web site is:
>
>     http://www.kalamazoolinux.org/
>
>
>--__--__--
>
>Message: 2
>Date: Fri, 30 Aug 2002 09:41:40 -0400
>To: Kalamazoo LUG <members@kalamazoolinux.org>
>From: Peter Buxton <peter@killdevil.org>
>Subject: [KLUG Members] LAN's and DNS
>Reply-To: members@kalamazoolinux.org
>
>
>--n8g4imXOkfNTN/H1
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>
>
>Okay, so address 192.168.1.0/24, e.g., is "invisible" to the outside
>world. Cool. But what about internal address NAMES? Since our ISP is the
>NS for caresswm.org (the www. name and the MX records) and since I DON'T
>want to serve as our own authoritative NS to the Real World(tm), what do
>I do?=20
>
>1. If I can set bind to go out to the ISP for unknown addresses, I can
>    name all the machines thisandthat.caresswm.org and just leave
>    www.caresswm.org undefined. Do I set myself as a slave of our ISP, or
>    do I use the "hints" option?
>
>2. Fictional names: I can just tell the machines they are in domain
>    cares.lan, which is not unlike the 192 addresses in that they don't
>    exist on the greater internet. Assuming my MTA knows to stamp mail
>    with the proper domain (and it does), and I have no other services to
>    the outside world (aside from AUTH), is this a good plan?
>
>TIA
>
>--=20
>http://www.killdevil.org/~peter
>but if we know anything about god,
>god is *arbitrary*. -- bob dylan
>
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>--n8g4imXOkfNTN/H1--
>
>--__--__--
>
>Message: 3
>Subject: Re: [KLUG Members] LAN's and DNS
>From: Bruce Smith <bruce@armintl.com>
>To: KLUG members <members@kalamazoolinux.org>
>Date: 30 Aug 2002 10:21:57 -0400
>Reply-To: members@kalamazoolinux.org
>
> > Okay, so address 192.168.1.0/24, e.g., is "invisible" to the outside
> > world. Cool. But what about internal address NAMES? Since our ISP is the
> > NS for caresswm.org (the www. name and the MX records) and since I DON'T
> > want to serve as our own authoritative NS to the Real World(tm), what do
> > I do?
>
>What I do, is run my own DNS server(s) on my internal LAN, and point all
>internal clients to those DNS server(s).  Those internal DNS server(s)
>are authoritative for my domain(s), all other DNS queries are forwarded
>outside to get real IP addresses.
>
>i.e. If an internal client requests the IP address for www.caresswm.org,
>it receives the 192.168.0.x address from your own DNS server.  If they
>request www.yahoo.com, your DNS server forwards the request to the
>internet returning yahoo's real address.
>
>Clients from the real internet use real internet DNS servers and receive
>the 216.109.195.249 address for www.caresswm.org.
>
>That way it's all transparent to the users, and no need for two names
>for each server.
>
>--------------------------------------------
>Bruce Smith                bruce@armintl.com
>System Administrator / Network Administrator
>Armstrong International, Inc.
>Three Rivers, Michigan  49093  USA
>http://www.armstrong-intl.com/
>--------------------------------------------
>
>
>--__--__--
>
>Message: 4
>Date: Fri, 30 Aug 2002 09:30:52 -0400
>From: adam@morrison-ind.com
>To: members@kalamazoolinux.org
>Subject: Re: [KLUG Members] LAN's and DNS
>Reply-To: members@kalamazoolinux.org
>
> >Okay, so address 192.168.1.0/24, e.g., is "invisible" to the outside
> >world. Cool. But what about internal address NAMES? Since our ISP is the
> >NS for caresswm.org (the www. name and the MX records) and since I DON'T
> >want to serve as our own authoritative NS to the Real World(tm), what do
> >I do?
>
>You create a "split horizon".  In effect your already doing it on the IP level
>with NAT,  your inside machines have a diffrent view of the world than those
>standing outside and looking at you.
>
> >1. If I can set bind to go out to the ISP for unknown addresses, I can
> >   name all the machines thisandthat.caresswm.org and just leave
> >   www.caresswm.org undefined. Do I set myself as a slave of our ISP, or
> >   do I use the "hints" option?
> >2. Fictional names: I can just tell the machines they are in domain
> >   cares.lan, which is not unlike the 192 addresses in that they don't
> >   exist on the greater internet. Assuming my MTA knows to stamp mail
> >   with the proper domain (and it does), and I have no other services to
> >   the outside world (aside from AUTH), is this a good plan?
>
>The master internal bind server here is SOA for morrison-ind.com (and 
>others).
>So internal clients get a direct answer from him (or her, depends on how 
>the day
>is going).  There is also a "real" SOA in the outside world.  In the real SOA
>there are typically VERY few records: www, mail, and one or two MXs.  I simply
>add the www address to the internal SOA (mail and MX are different 
>internally).
>  So if the external hosting company canges the IP on there webserver(s) 
> then my
>internal people won't be able to see the extranet page until I update it.  But
>in ~4 years that has never happened.
>
>Would be pretty trivial to write a cron job to check the ISP SOA for www and
>nsupdate the internal master,  but in ~4 years....
>
>--__--__--
>
>Message: 5
>Subject: Re: [KLUG Members] LAN's and DNS
>From: Bruce Smith <bruce@armintl.com>
>To: KLUG members <members@kalamazoolinux.org>
>Date: 30 Aug 2002 10:57:30 -0400
>Reply-To: members@kalamazoolinux.org
>
> > >Okay, so address 192.168.1.0/24, e.g., is "invisible" to the outside
> > >world. Cool. But what about internal address NAMES? Since our ISP is the
> > >NS for caresswm.org (the www. name and the MX records) and since I DON'T
> > >want to serve as our own authoritative NS to the Real World(tm), what do
> > >I do?
> >
> > You create a "split horizon".  In effect your already doing it on the 
> IP level
> > with NAT,  your inside machines have a diffrent view of the world than 
> those
> > standing outside and looking at you.
> >
> > >1. If I can set bind to go out to the ISP for unknown addresses, I can
> > >   name all the machines thisandthat.caresswm.org and just leave
> > >   www.caresswm.org undefined. Do I set myself as a slave of our ISP, or
> > >   do I use the "hints" option?
> > >2. Fictional names: I can just tell the machines they are in domain
> > >   cares.lan, which is not unlike the 192 addresses in that they don't
> > >   exist on the greater internet. Assuming my MTA knows to stamp mail
> > >   with the proper domain (and it does), and I have no other services to
> > >   the outside world (aside from AUTH), is this a good plan?
> >
> > The master internal bind server here is SOA for morrison-ind.com (and 
> others).
> > So internal clients get a direct answer from him (or her, depends on 
> how the day
> > is going).  There is also a "real" SOA in the outside world.  In the 
> real SOA
> > there are typically VERY few records: www, mail, and one or two MXs.  I 
> simply
> > add the www address to the internal SOA (mail and MX are different 
> internally).
> >  So if the external hosting company canges the IP on there webserver(s) 
> then my
> > internal people won't be able to see the extranet page until I update 
> it.  But
> > in ~4 years that has never happened.
> >
> > Would be pretty trivial to write a cron job to check the ISP SOA for 
> www and
> > nsupdate the internal master,  but in ~4 years....
>
>I was confused for a minute, but I see your web server is hosted by an
>external company.
>
>Here, we run our own web server in house, where it has a private IP on
>the DMZ (converted to a real IP by NAT for external queries).
>
>Your answer assumed that www.caresswm.org hosted externally, and I was
>assuming that it was internal like mine.
>
>So Peter, use whichever solution fits your actual setup!  :-)
>
>--------------------------------------------
>Bruce Smith                bruce@armintl.com
>System Administrator / Network Administrator
>Armstrong International, Inc.
>Three Rivers, Michigan  49093  USA
>http://www.armstrong-intl.com/
>--------------------------------------------
>
>
>--__--__--
>
>Message: 6
>Date: Fri, 30 Aug 2002 11:08:01 -0400
>To: members@kalamazoolinux.org
>Subject: Re: [KLUG Members] LAN's and DNS
>From: Peter Buxton <peter@killdevil.org>
>Reply-To: members@kalamazoolinux.org
>
>On Fri, Aug 30, 2002 at 10:57:30AM -0400, Bruce Smith wrote:
>
> > I was confused for a minute, but I see your web server is hosted by an
> > external company.
>
>Yup! Sorry, I had that in mind as I was writing it (obviously, heh) and
>*utterly* forgot to put it to pap--... uh, keyboard. Electrons?
>
>Either way, I just wanted to make sure I wasn't ignoring the One True
>Way to maintain a NAT'ed LAN name system. Or, for that matter, any
>_better_ way. Thanks!
>
>--
>http://www.killdevil.org/~peter
>
>
>--__--__--
>
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