[KLUG Advocacy] No OS immune to DOS attacks... [consolidated response]

[magoo]

[consolidated response]

> > Never needed OLE, ADO, MDAC, the SAM, COM/DOM, NetBEUI, and the GDI to
> > run a simple word processor in M$ Office... basic composing, spell
> > checking, saving, and printing!  My 8 1/2 year old can handle that...
> 
> You don't need them until they go awry. Then you find you do. And they
> go awry quite often, even at Pharmacia/Pfizer, which had a first-class
> Windows setup (maintained, may I add, by geeks).

Never had a single problem with any of the above acronyms.  Just lucky? 
 
> > The typical end user's intelligence is grossly exaggerated by Linux
> > developers.  
> 
> As long as the distros want popularity, they will fund developers who
> make things easy.

Excellent point!  I am hoping that distros do want to be popular 
with the desktop folks!  ...not just the systems or network admins, 
the Apache wizards, programmers, and database devotees!!!  The 
average clueless, dumb, and digitally bewildered office worker.  
Someone like ME!!! 

> Ralph, it sounds as though you think Windows and MS products are 
> superior. That's fine. That's your opinion. But that's all. MS 
> products are certainly not superior for what I'm doing. 

PLEASE!!!  That is way too much of a presupposition.  I have used 
Linux for 10 years... Apple for 10 years...  Microsoft for 20 years 
and I find they all have strengths and weaknesses. 

Never addressed the point you impose in your question... you did 
though.  On the desktop... Microsoft is #1 right now and has been! 
Linus claims to be focused on the desktop (not necessarily for the 
office user?) but then OO sits far from where it should be. 

> Are we talking about applications or file formats?  This is all to
vague 
> to mean anything.  Sure OO needs/needed M$-Office import/exporters. 
And 
> M$-Office needs/needed WP/123/Quatro/etc.... import/exporters.  So 
> what.  There are many applications in the world, the import/export
thing 
> isn't going away. 
> 
> If you find the OO import/exporters a problem - OK.  Say that. 
> 

BOTH application function and compatible input/output file format 
are important.  Yes, both are lacking in OO! 

Single standalone business workstations with applications 
running (and data stored) on a local hard drive are a tough 
mindset for network folks to grasp.  It is different... and 
Microsoft grew up in that environment.  Linux developers 
are network oriented. 

OO_Writer - fine import/export superb 

OO_Calc -  all Excel functions are NOT supported 
Imports bomb if a unsupported function was used. 
[Note: GNUmeric DOES support all Excel functions.] 

OO_Impress - fine import/export superb 

MySQL  - user friendly GUI interface for dumb monkeys? 

Bundle these together and try and convert the masses. 
Then Linux developers can dazzle the evolutionary code 
out of a chimps ear and give us better and better 
everything!!!  Of course, Open Source software is not 
free of charge any longer but you have support and very 
good software.  :-) 

Paint me a M$ geek if you want... guess nobody was getting 
my original point that Linux is NOT ready for the desktop 
and tried to take every side road and diversionary leap 
possible to avoid addressing the specifics. 

> Have you used OO extensively?  I have, and there are (at least)
several 
> companies in GR that do.  I've yet to have OO be in the way of
anything 
> I wanted to do, and I manage some pretty large and complext documents.
Extensive use does not negate the missing functionality and 
file format problems.  I wish it would... I'd get extensive!!!  :-) 

> I'm curious what the specific issues with OO as an application that 
> you've discovered.  I can list mine if you like. 

OK... I did!  Waiting for OO to be a player... not yet. 
IBM said so, Adam... it MUST be true, right! 
Not good enough for IBM... not good enough for ME! 

> Sorry, but really stupid people can use OO, Evolution, and Galeon too.
> I've got some I could introduce you to. 

Best news I have heard in this discussion! 
And on the X2 desktop...I presume? 

> Wrong!  M$ Office may be great - what it is suffering from is derived 
> from what it rests upon.  To build an art mueseum one still has to
start 
> with the boring old poured concrete foundation, plumbing, and 
> electrical.  Otherwise you'll loose all that art when the building
falls 
> in on itself.  Which I've experienced on M$ products more times than I
> can count. 
> 

Amen, brother Williams!  
The congregation may be seated! 
I like the way you just said that!!!   BRAVO 
You are exactly right. 

I'll be ringing the firebell when I find a Linux distro and 
functional and compatible office suite that lunges for the 
office mass market and DA MONEY BABY, DA MONEY.  Billy'$ 
billion$ came from meeting consumer demand.  OFFICE!!! 

Linux is better in many ways... ideal, model, code, etc. 
Yes... managing a kernel project is much afield from managing 
an office suite development army.  Bill Joy is available... 
Some day Linux WILL arrive for the business mass market. 

Ximian Evolution has crashed twice while I was writing this.
At least it kept recovering this twice lost response!  I get
CORBA errors and have to restart about every other document
I work on.  Flakey... nice, but buggy!  Eudora was NEVER buggy!
Even Eudora Light ver 3.0.3 <my favorite still> was rock solid.